take a look at this...

[Warrior381]

If robots and computers, were to become more intelligent, to the point of being our assistants, then how would this new way of computer and robot thinking, effect mankind?

Would robots and compter users want to control mankind more, like in the Matrix, or would robots and computer and man, get along better?

What do you think about new operating systems, such as Microsoft's proposed Longhorn, which can self configure; is this a step in the right direction?


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[Keven]

the matrix could never happen, humans are supieor to machines in one way, we can cheat and act out side of our programing, since we have no programing. we can do things that aren't logical.

 

[RainmanTime]

What do you think about new operating systems, such as Microsoft's proposed Longhorn, which can self configure; is this a step in the right direction?

As a guy who works on flight critical software systems (which must NEVER lock-up like your Windows PC) I have a lot of contempt for Microsoft. Before they worry about things like self-configuring OS, I think there are two major things they should get right before ANYTHING else (especially unnecessary functions):

1) Stabilize the OS so it is as reliable as the automatic pilot systems that fly commercial airplanes all over the world. (i.e. no more "blue screens of death")
2) Secure the OS so hackers and virus programmers have no means to exploit weaknesses.

If they ever fix these major headaches, THEN I might be interested in novelty features.

Kind Regards,
RainmanTime

 

[RainmanTime]

the matrix could never happen, humans are supieor to machines in one way, we can cheat and act out side of our programing, since we have no programing. we can do things that aren't logical.

I wouldn't be so sure of that, Keven. And besides that, use of the word "never" can often backfire on you. Do you know who issued the statement "Man will never achieve powered flight"? None other than Orville Wright, right after one of their earliest failures!!!

How do you know that we have no programming? Or even more pertinent: How do you know there have not been computers developed already that can think and reason outside their programming? In point of fact, I can tell you there have been such computer programs created using various forms of Artificial Intelligence. Their "programming" is not what you typically think of a program that you write on your PC in VisualBasic. These advanced computers actually have the ability to learn new relationships, and even modify portions of their basic code...thereby introducing new (novel) capabilities they did not have before. There are even computers smart enough to teach other computers what they know and what they have learned.

There are some who believe we are already living in a fake "Matrix-type" existence. I don't subscribe to that, but I do believe it could come to pass some day.

Kind Regards,
RainmanTime

 

[Keven]

best example I can give is in a racing car video game, while human players take short cuts over the grass and dirt at the side of the track, computer players always stick to the road, so we always will have an edge on them. Plus i don't think computers can form opinions about this they know nothing about, unlike humans

 

[Guest]

I think that Computers, as we know them now, will have no choice but to coexist with us. As one AI comp might want to take control, it would be restricted to threatening out memory or whatever on the computer. I couldn't start a factory making killerbots to be it's soldiers, it could only threaten what we've given it. Even then, we could "pull the plug" on them if we wanted to, so it must coexist with us as we are the ones with supreme power over them.

While AI might upgrade itself software-ily, it couldn't do it physically. One well-placed EMP could wipe it clean if we wanted to go that far.

If a big computer like in Collosus: The Forbin Project was to come up, in charge of our nuclear weapons and other WMD's, that might be a different story. If we don't give them too much power to use against us, they won't rise up.

 

[Guest]

You have a point the computers we use now do not and can not cheat. However, these computers are not free thinking beings, if they become so then they will be able to cheat and far greater than humans. In the racing games, you may only cheat as far as the computer allows. They can not exceed their programming, but neither can you.... So who has the edge, think about that.

 

[Guest]

While AI might upgrade itself software-ily, it couldn't do it physically.

Are you insane, even as I type, machines are making machines in car, toy, and even computer factories around the world. Machines are built to create physical things, both things pleasing to the human senses: Movies, massagers, candies, and things damaging to humans: Sonic weapons, guns, poison.

However, I doubt we will ever come up with true robotic intelligence, because most do not even understand what gives us our intelligence.

If we ever were successful in creating self conscious robots, we could not expect to have contorol over them, and we would not need to fear all of them. With intelligance comes agency and choice. The robots would not be bound to serve us, neither would they be fated to destroy us. The robots would do as they please, just as humans do now. Some would kill indescrimenatley, some would take it upon them to protect the weak (us).

 

[Keven]

I'm not sure what you meant, robots could never defeat humans because humans think differently than robots, we have radical Ideas. And since robots have to follow a linear path in their thinking they don't have ideas, I mean we could invent new weapons and the robots could just upgrade them.

Well they do have ideas but they don't have sudden ideas, I mean like out of the blue think of some new revolutionary device that would wipe out humans in an instant.

 

[Guest]

think about this Anonymous: A PC plugged into a wall. does this computer have arms? cann it wipe it's own butt, let alone install more RAM? I think not. They might manipulate others into doing it for them, but the PC you are looking at now cannot.

those machoines used to make cars in detroit? They cannot change themselves into killerobot makers. They "lack the opposable thumbs!"

 

[Keven]

they also cannot improvise

 

[Viceroy]

Humans do have programming. We are programmed by our parents, by our society, by our peers - and by ourselves. It is this self-programming that makes us (currently) different from programs, nothing else. It is foolish to assume that your brain is anything but a large computer. Humans do things that are illogical to other humans, but never anything that is illogical to themselves at the time that they do it.

However, this doesn't mean that a robot would have a soul (whatever that is)...

 

[Keven]

people who hear voices do things that seem illogic to them

 

[gadgetere]

True intelligence is unnecessary for robots. It is possible to create an adaptable robot ("Tab Books, BUILD YOUR OWN SELF-PROGRAMMING ROBOT", written more than a decade ago!). As much as I love gadgets, there is often a DOWN side to technology. Military attack devices consider you as nothing more than a TARGET. I do not like to be thought so, by a machine with vastly superior reaction time.

HDTV is another example of woe; programming and commercials are more expensive, broadcast power is as much as 10x analog (trying to compensate for worse UHF propogation), the converters you buy will BURN those black lines into your screen (ruining forever your set), and nothing will help your current pocket TVs. I have more than a dozen of those*, all go in the TRASH. And from across the room, no one with average sight can see any improvement in picture --- I've seen them side-by-side. The bill was railroaded through Congress by profiteers, and likely will end free TV. Single parents, fixed-income, senior citizens and retirees? Tough toenails --- buy new equipment or don't watch...

A question has been asked, "has technology LESSENED our workload, or INCREASED it?" Are we happier and slower-paced than our parents? Or more harried and stressed?


* each one is different. One is B&amp;W, but has a flip-up screen &amp; mirror, WATCHABLE in sunlight (all the current ones with backlights are BLACK outside), and it has an AM/FM radio built in. Runs off of 3 volts. Try to find any shirt-pocket set, radio or TV, that will recieve UHF. There are different color ones, some with mirror (the light uses more power than the TV), one is a Watchman that has an actual glass CRT (you look through the SIDE of the tube, the phosphor is on the BACK side; but it's the sharpest picture of all). Every single one will go in the trash...

...I also have a Seiko wristwatch TV, it goes in the trash when analog stops...

 

[Imenilop]

I agree with anonymous. If a robot wields a brain (or computer) similar to a human's brain, they will probably act like humans and not really care about anything long as their batteries are replaced. What motive would they have for world domination? The only way they would have a motive is if they are specially programmed to have one, but if they receive any permanent inscription in their programming, they will ultimately be in inferior to humans, since they will have a limitation.
So, no, robots probably dont have a reason to rise up against humans, and if they do, they probably would not band up to do so.

 

[Keven]

if they were programed with a survial insticnt

 

[solicraft]

very intersting debate!
When Honda brought out its 6foot high robot we were very interested in why?, so we rang up Honda one night (were in england) and asked about its function, they said"It is desighned to walk up and down stairs and lift and carry people for instance in old folks homes etc" this souded admirable untill we asked the m question,"what could its militaristic use be " they instantly hung up....
My advice is never underestimate the opposition, even if it is a machine , a good line of research for boffins with plenty of cash and nothing to do would be to design a gadget to take these "robots " down . neither did the japanese reply to my question why is its aluminium "skin " one quarter to three eighths thick !! thick enough to stop a bullet i wonder!....... and how many have they made,???? Ill leave this with you ...what do you think.


yours sincerly

solicraft

 

[1stBorn]

check this out it's an AI application that actually gets "smarter", or learns, each time it is played. It's easy to play.. think of an object, and answer the questions accordingly. It's suprisingly accurate. I thought of the word electron and it guessed it.. I almost fell out of my seat.

http://y.20q.net:8095/

1stBorn

 

[cpguy]

If we ever were successful in creating self conscious robots, we could not expect to have contorol over them, and we would not need to fear all of them. With intelligance comes agency and choice. The robots would not be bound to serve us, neither would they be fated to destroy us. The robots would do as they please, just as humans do now. Some would kill indescrimenatley, some would take it upon them to protect the weak (us). (-by Anonymous)

I think that we would have to coexist peacefully when the time (if ever) comes. I believe if machines would want agency and choice they would want it without serving us even though we made them. Also if we could control them could they erase some things that we have recorded in the database systems such as the internet?

I am just thinking. Could this really be someday?

-cpguy

 

[AlienChild]

True intelligence is unnecessary for robots...... Maybe but that never stoped humans from creating something unnecessary. It only takes on scientist to create it and then it becomes main stream and exeptable, we are a sociaty of mass consuption and most of the products that are releassed to the masses today have not been completely analized and processed for futher evaluation. We consume faster than we can process. Now just immagine the release of the "smart Robot", it can upgrade, learn and serve you at your wish, that is untill it watches TV for an hour of so and figures out that it can fight back.

First thing we'll know it that the company that relessed the Robot will recal it for "repair", it will not want to go back...." No dissasamble #5", create a support group, get some more robots and fight back !!!!

With all this being said! It's innevitable, it will happen, mankind is too stupid not to Fu@#!$ up.